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Religion Discordianism

maddsurgeon

Avatar: Denim Skirt
13

Level 21 Camwhore

“Playground Pin-Up”

Fnord, indeed.

Pickled male reproductive organ-
bum

Avatar: Pickled Dickbutt's Avatar
47

[Board of Directors]

Level 10 Camwhore

AHAHA HEADSETS

its things like that which make it hard to take discordianism seriously, not that it wants to be taken seriously, i guess. but those who live by it get offended when you scoff at them for their choice in belief structure.

Ifnord

Avatar: Blood Cells
1

[in4mador]

Level 10 Emo Kid

“Gloomy Gus”

He’s Fnord. I’m Fnord. Log in to see images!

maddsurgeon

Avatar: Denim Skirt
13

Level 21 Camwhore

“Playground Pin-Up”

If you take Discordianism seriously, you aren’t a Discordian. It’s a bit like Taoism that way.

(fnord)

wickedwitch23

Avatar: Corset 2

[The Flamers of Loa-
thing
]

Level 7 Camwhore

“Training Broad”

Point Apple: I cannot take the practices of Discordianism seriously and/or/counter-contrariwise literally, but I also think anyone who does has completely missed the point.

Pointy Bong: I do take the importance and usefulness of Sacred Lies and Sacred Laughter seriously, and think it’s what makes Discordianism ring True-ish for many, even after they get past the novelty of it being totally halarious.

Pointed Chaos: Ask thineself thus: Which is the “real” Discordian… the one who shuns the hotdog bun? Or the one who says, “The Goddess says ‘no can haz’ on the hotdog bun… Screw that!” and shoves the forbidden bread into his happy mouth? Verily, make certain to answer thineself after asking.

Point at the Disco!: ILLUMINATUS! is one of the most holy texts I’ve ever read, for me, because it is deeply True, though not completely factual.

Points on Eris: I’m not actually a Discordian, anyway… so don’t trust what I say. Also, don’t trust me if I say, “This *should* work…” or if I ask to borrow a piece of chalk. Also, don’t trust anyone who does claim to be an actual Discordian. Or anyone else. If you think you’re in danger of trusting someone, consult one gland or another… the pineal is just as good as most of the rest.

Past the apple orchard, then turn left at the FNORD: As for explaining Discordianism to others, I tend to focus on the importance of Sacred Lies as a means of leading one toward Truth without just handing it over to them. Of course, I give them just enough to make them want more, if they’re ready to want more. It wouldn’t make much sense at that point to start handing out all the answers, and I hate to have guests stay too long, anyhow.

maddsurgeon

Avatar: Denim Skirt
13

Level 21 Camwhore

“Playground Pin-Up”

wickedwitch23 Posted:

ILLUMINATUS! is one of the most holy texts I’ve ever read, for me, because it is deeply True, though not completely factual.

I couldn’t agree more. Anyone who hasn’t read this book should. Anyone who has should read it again.

Amp Zaphrix

Avatar: Middle Finger
2

Level 10 Troll

“Pain in the ASCII”

In all sort-of-but-not-really seriousness, I think the only thing one really needs to deem as a rule is the Wiccan rede: An’ it harm none, do as thy wilt.

Now, it may not seem very chaotic and unpredictable if I am observing that rule to the best of my abilities at all times, but the way I see it, I’m being so non-conformist that I’m not even conforming with the non-conformists.

Now I shall joyously eat a hot dog.

Also, FNORD

dreamserpent

Avatar: dreamserpent's Avatar
12

Level 10 Camwhore

“Leave it to Cleavage”

the principia reads like an episode of monty python. I don’t remember why I thought this was funny when I was younger.

Pickled male reproductive organ-
bum

Avatar: Pickled Dickbutt's Avatar
47

[Board of Directors]

Level 10 Camwhore

AHAHA HEADSETS

these shirts reminded me of you guys.

Lactose the -
Intolerant

Avatar: Goiter
2

Level 10 Troll

“Pain in the ASCII”

I, Lactose the Intolerant, Existentialist Chimneysweep, Cavalier du l’Esprit d’Esclair, Soldier of Misfortune, proclaim you all to be heretics, you are more debased than that white crust that deodorant leaves on the underarms of clothes. May you all reincarnate as a Republican Senator’s page!

In other words, Hey guys!

OK, now that that’s done with, I’d just like to say that I’m glad to see that there are people with a keen appreciation for absurdity here. May St. Yossarian watch over you all, and may you always see the Fnords. That is all.

Lactose the -
Intolerant

Avatar: Goiter
2

Level 10 Troll

“Pain in the ASCII”

wickedwitch23 Posted:

Point Apple: I cannot take the practices of Discordianism seriously and/or/counter-contrariwise literally, but I also think anyone who does has completely missed the point.

Pointy Bong: I do take the importance and usefulness of Sacred Lies and Sacred Laughter seriously, and think it’s what makes Discordianism ring True-ish for many, even after they get past the novelty of it being totally halarious.

Pointed Chaos: Ask thineself thus: Which is the “real” Discordian… the one who shuns the hotdog bun? Or the one who says, “The Goddess says ‘no can haz’ on the hotdog bun… Screw that!” and shoves the forbidden bread into his happy mouth? Verily, make certain to answer thineself after asking.

Point at the Disco!: ILLUMINATUS! is one of the most holy texts I’ve ever read, for me, because it is deeply True, though not completely factual.

Points on Eris: I’m not actually a Discordian, anyway… so don’t trust what I say. Also, don’t trust me if I say, “This *should* work…” or if I ask to borrow a piece of chalk. Also, don’t trust anyone who does claim to be an actual Discordian. Or anyone else. If you think you’re in danger of trusting someone, consult one gland or another… the pineal is just as good as most of the rest.

Past the apple orchard, then turn left at the FNORD: As for explaining Discordianism to others, I tend to focus on the importance of Sacred Lies as a means of leading one toward Truth without just handing it over to them. Of course, I give them just enough to make them want more, if they’re ready to want more. It wouldn’t make much sense at that point to start handing out all the answers, and I hate to have guests stay too long, anyhow.

The idea of Sacred Lies is pretty important concept for me as well. I always saw it in stages:

1) This stuff is really serious, I had better study it.

2) This stuff is a load of dingo’s kidneys, I got ripped off.

3) This stuff is a load of dingo’s kidneys, but then again, so is everything else.

4) This makes just as much sense as the others, so what the hell.

5) This is more fun than sitting in a dusty church somewhere and being lectured by smarmy guys in good suits.

If you want an inspiring perspective on Sacred Lies, check out “Cat’s Cradle” by Vonnegut. Bokonon is a Discordian saint for a damn good reason.

maddsurgeon

Avatar: Denim Skirt
13

Level 21 Camwhore

“Playground Pin-Up”

Velveteen Posted:

these shirts reminded me of you guys.

I love it! It’s good to see that OM is in full effect.

wickedwitch23

Avatar: Corset 2

[The Flamers of Loa-
thing
]

Level 7 Camwhore

“Training Broad”

Amp Zaphrix Posted:

In all sort-of-but-not-really seriousness, I think the only thing one really needs to deem as a rule is the Wiccan rede: An’ it harm none, do as thy wilt.

My understanding… which is still incomplete, though less incomplete than, say, ten years ago… is that “Uncle Gerald” felt it necessary to include that because people truly seemed to need to be told, at that time, that society can go suck a nut. That if what you are doing does not actually harm another person, you shouldn’t be so worried about “But what will the neighbors think?” because, quite frankly, the neighbors don’t even need to know. That fear was likely to keep a lot more people from persuing their desires then than it still does now.

Whether this is true or not, I think the idea has some merit. Some people still need to be told it’s just none of anyone else’s business, and the worst they can really do is not like you, so go ahead and do your thing. However, while I am a person who is not inclined to purposefully hurt others, I would still take this a bit further. Just go ahead and do as thou wilt… but be prepared for the consequences. If understanding the consequences makes you decide you don’t like this idea so much after all, and that setting fire to your neighbor’s dog isn’t really what you want, that’s great. But if you do go ahead and set fire to the dog, I don’t wanna hear you **** when the neighbors take you to court, the judge makes you buy them a new dog, they tell everyone in town what you did, and nightmares keep you awake. You brought that **** on yourself.

Not that I think *you* would… I just feel weird constantly saying, “One brought that **** on oneself.”

Most people I know… who may very well not be representative of “most people”... choose to do things harmful to others because they don’t think it through beforehand, or expect to be able to escape consequences. I’d rather have people do the wrong thing, having thought it out and honestly decided to be an bumhole, rather than have them do the right thing just because a rule told them to.

Beasto

Avatar: Poison Warning Sign

Level 10 Troll

“Pain in the ASCII”

Anyone who still talks about or even thinks about discordianism after their soft-more year of college is emotionally stunted. This was basically the 1960s equivalent of stupid pirate-ninja-Chuck Norris jokes, folks. Come on kiddies, wouldn’t you like to try a grown-up book now? Log in to see images!

Oh, and the Illuminatus Trilogy it only seems clever if its the only book other than TSR fiction or Log in to see images!

Amp Zaphrix

Avatar: Middle Finger
2

Level 10 Troll

“Pain in the ASCII”

Personally, Wicked, I follow the Rede because, let’s face it, bad **** happens to people as it is, there’s no need to add to it. Of course, that’s just my five cents.

maddsurgeon

Avatar: Denim Skirt
13

Level 21 Camwhore

“Playground Pin-Up”

Beasto Posted:

Anyone who still talks about or even thinks about discordianism after their soft-more year of college is emotionally stunted. This was basically the 1960s equivalent of stupid pirate-ninja-Chuck Norris jokes, folks. Come on kiddies, wouldn’t you like to try a grown-up book now? Log in to see images!

What exactly is the prevailing philosophy behind Chuck Norris jokes? What is the aesthetic statement? I must have missed it.

A piece of art doesn’t have to be serious to be meaningful. That’s precisely the point. If we stop taking the universe seriously, we get rid of hate and fear. There’s nothing in here that isn’t in Zen Buddhism or Taoism. The authors of Principia Discordia simply had the advantage of living after Western thinkers finally figured this stuff out…

So, yeah. You fail. Read again.

Amp Zaphrix

Avatar: Middle Finger
2

Level 10 Troll

“Pain in the ASCII”

Like I said before, Surgeon, Zen with ADD.

Beasto

Avatar: Poison Warning Sign

Level 10 Troll

“Pain in the ASCII”

maddsurgeon Posted:

If we stop taking the universe seriously, we get rid of hate and fear.

...

So, yeah. You fail. Read again.

Ahhh… sweet irony. *snorrrrt* Oh yeah, that’s the ****.

wickedwitch23

Avatar: Corset 2

[The Flamers of Loa-
thing
]

Level 7 Camwhore

“Training Broad”

Amp Zaphrix Posted:

Personally, Wicked, I follow the Rede because, let’s face it, bad **** happens to people as it is, there’s no need to add to it. Of course, that’s just my five cents.

Now that’s a view I can agree with! I think that’s a wonderful reason to follow it, though I’d like to point out on little thing, just because I can get nit-picky over the strangest things. (Seriously, I’m well aware that the things I get so picky about just make other people ask, “Why the hell does it matter?” ) Saying that one rule is the Rede is like saying “Honor thy father and mother” is the ten commandments. It’s not. It’s one part, and is to be considered within the context of the whole. Personally, I blame Llewellyn Publishing for people giving the impression (often without meaning to, I understand) that the whole ****ing Rede is simply that one part. I’m probably being unfair to Llewellyn Publishing, but I’m willing to accept the consequences if I am.

Which brings me back to my point…

If you follow the rule of doing what you want, as long as it doesn’t harm others, because you deeply feel it’s the best way to do things, that’s good. But, if we bring it down to making rules for people to follow, I’m more for personal accountability and responsibility. I would make a rule that tells people to do what they want, but understand and accept the consequences. People like you, or myself, who have no wish to bring harm to others wouldn’t really have to change or behavior.

My point wasn’t that there’s anything wrong with having a personal standard for not harming others. My point was that when religions (and Wicca is a religion) give followers rules for standards of behavior, there’s the likelihood that, in time, people will just blindly follow the rule because it is there. I’ve seen this happen with Wicca. The idea of that rule being included in the Rede to let people know it’s okay to do what you want as long as it’s not harming anyone was told to me by several people over the years, all of them being people who are old enough to be my parents and started studying Wicca in the late 70’s. I’m open to the possibility that it didn’t happen that way, but I figure they’ve been at this long enough they may have the story right. At any rate, it has become pretty common to hear Wiccans say, “The Rede says ‘harm none’.” Well… that’s a matter of interpretation, isn’t it? If it was included to mean that you don’t have to worry about what other people think, it’s not “bad” if it’s not hurting anyone, then that’s not quite the same as saying, “If it does harm someone, you are forbidden to do it.” If it is, in fact, forbidding harmful actions, I at least find it a little upsetting that many teachers use this as a reason to teach their students not to even learn about harmful magic. Isn’t that what a lot of Pagans leave Christian churches over… being told, “You’re bad if you do this, so don’t even learn about it ‘cause that’s bad, too”?

That’s why I said I’d rather someone honestly decided to be an bumhole than blindly followed a rule that forbids them from being one. Neither of those is my Number One Pick for the kind of person I strive to be, or want to have around. The Number One Pick would be someone who has honestly decided to be a kind person.

maddsurgeon

Avatar: Denim Skirt
13

Level 21 Camwhore

“Playground Pin-Up”

Beasto: You didn’t answer my first question. You didn’t answer my second question. You didn’t answer my fifth question. And I see you didn’t READ AGAIN. You’re terrible at following directions. Congratulations, you’re on your way to becoming a Discordian. Hail Eris!

NO SRSLY,

Do you have a better philosophy/religion? What is your “grown-up book?” I’m not being sarcastic; I actually want to know. I think it’s important. Because I still insist that the PD is a satirical and light-hearted but accurate attack on the follies inherent in Western philosophy, and those follies are deadly serious. Because I take Malcalypse the Younger seriously, I am free to take Plato foolishly (or do you actually believe that behind what we witness as reality is a world of Perfect Forms?)

While altogether ridiculous, the PD lends itself quite easily to serious literary analysis/philosophical discussion. For example, look again at

Page 65

What we have here is a pretty obvious spoof on the “proofs for the existence of God.” If you’ve had a basic philosophy course they should be very familiar. The folly, of course is obvious – people get caught up in rational cause/effect argument when they were trying to prove something essentially irrational.

The folly of atheism is to bumume that because you cannot prove rationally the existence of God/Goddess (or anything, for that matter), it cannot possibly be true. It is as dogmatic as theism, really.

The fact of the matter is that reality is not rational, and even if it were, we wouldn’t know about it, because we are not experiencing reality but our own personal reality-tunnel, which is influenced by cultural bias. The bumumption that the order we project on the universe is actually inherent is the Aneristic Illusion. Does is bother you to have a silly name for a serious thing? We could call it something else instead. How about, I dunno, Objectivism? Log in to see images!

Religions and philosophies that operate under the Eristic Illusion are important because they train our minds to deal with problems that cannot be addressed by Aristotlean logic (to bumume these problems simply don’t exist or aren’t important, as many atheists do, is the most ridiculous type nihilistic hubris I’ve ever heard). For instance, my five-year-old asked the other day:

“When we die, are we awake or asleep?”

(The correct answer, of course, is “Mu.” Without Discordianism, I would not have known this.)

maddsurgeon edited this message on 03/13/2008 5:22PM
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