As yet again, we end up with more submissions than we know what to do with. The current system is rife with abuse and buildr score simply raises the amount of abuse that can happen.

I’m not really saying I know how it needs to change but I know it needs to change.

some ideas:

-weighted voting by buildr score

i.e.: having a score over 5 gives you 2 votes for one, having a score over 10 gives you 3 votes and so on.

-limiting categories one can submit to by buildr score

i.e.: a score at 0 or below means you can only submit titles or angry replies, a score over 2 means you can submit another category, over 4 means you can submit 3 categories total. The last category to submit to should be forum ideas.

-if not limiting categories one can submit to by score, than increasing the cost to enter certain categories such as forum ideas and logos

they currently aren’t limited, which is why you end up with rampant abuse such as the last few weeks.

-limiting buildr score increases exponentially. By this I mean that as your score gets higher, it gets progressively more difficult for it to increase and easier for it to decrease. This would also be true in reverse that is it would be harder to decrease one’s score the lower it gets. This would be a big step toward limiting the number of submissions that can happen every week.

ANyway, we’re overloaded on subs these days because we suddenly have 150k users and buildr really isn’t designed for that many imo. thoughts?

Weighted voting would only make it ever easier for Bashy to win every single week

ah ninja’d >.> but ya you can’t look at the spam today and they thats the big problem with it

Jalapeno Bootyhole Posted:

There are already many topics devoted to fixing how the buildrs work, most of them related to downvoting, buildr score and max submissions. Needless to say, it’s not something that’s simple to answer, nor is there any kind of consensus.

In any case, we are determined to improve things for players however possible. Over the next while I plan to lead a “task force” to help us study the available options.

In the meantime, I’d say Klan **** You’s shenanigans today, bumuming it was out of protest, did little to help anyone’s cause. We’re more likely to improve things by working together and experimenting, not pulling disruptive stunts.

You obviouly are not aweare of what happenend here. We had nothing to do with it, some might have made a share, but it was J. Macs thing, and he deserves credit for it.

But yeah I dont like how buildr works, so I tend to avoid it (like I do with the rest of the gaming aspects of this website)

You know, I realize this was a rather excessive display and many players caught “submission fever”, but I see joke forums, logos and styles submitted all the time. I’ve never heard of anyone getting banned for submitting something like that.

I’ve also seen duplicate submissions made. Usually I will see that a logo or forum is nearing being voted off and suddenly it will be resubmitted – both submissions are active at the same time. Has this duplicating always been illegal?

I guess it seems odd to me. Is it actually fair to ban people for things without having rules in place first? Log in to see images! scully edited this message on 04/07/2009 12:51PM

Jalapeno Bootyhole Posted:

A joke submission is fine once in a while.

I really wonder if you get that it is that thought that makes your players insanely frustrated and annoyed from time to time. When something is ok to do sometimes it creates a feeling of complete persecution when it is suddenly punished. When player “a” can get away with this, but player “b” is punished it creates a pool of angst and hostility where those who are not in favor see no reason to continue, or if they do they see no reason not to lash out since they are expecting to be treated unfairly anyway.

There is also evidence of vote collusion.

Maybe there was stuff I didn’t see, but honestly, I think people were just bandwagoning and upvoting/downvoting whatever the hell they felt like voting. I was in idc and in the irc chats for Brainfreeze and GGM and no one was asking for votes, people were just going wacky with the creation and telling others to submit. Last week or maybe it was the week before there was a contest held asking people to submit everything as forum ideas. I saw a ton of rehashed old ideas. Hell, half the time I see old ideas from an inactive player I knew from back in Sisters of the Quivering Rose being entered as new ideas – we’re talking things from a year ago. It’s been brought up, no one cares. How is that different beyond the fact that logo was easier to spot?

I’m surprised I should have to explain this to a former mod.

Sure I was a mod, but honestly the only thing I picked up there was a good idea of what qualified as shock and what would slide through. The lines of what is ok and what is not were blurry at best even for the mods. Most days there were IMs, e-mails or forums posts from all of us wondering about some offense or near offense. That is beside the point, I’m not a mod, I’m a player and have been a player longer. I didn’t submit anything during the logo-a-thon, but as a player I don’t like the idea that there is a possibility of being banned for something I had no idea wasn’t legal. I might know it’s stupid or not intended, but much like the thing where spam tubmailing wasn’t said to be illegal and was suddenly punishable without warning, it is upsetting.

I get the dupe thing, although it’s weird when it is duping your own. (Damn wacky kids.) But, how could someone know that it is ok to submit a joke logo/forum/style/whatever sometimes, but if they submit over a certain number it is a problem?

It’s like leaving out a bowl of cookies in a room full of toddlers and expecting to come back and find that everyone only took one. I don’t want to be argumentative for the sake of being argumentative, I never think there is a point to that, but I do think that it is a silly thing to expect gamers to police themselves and not try to game the system if the system allows for it. It is the nature of the beast. If there is a loophole it will be found and abused. It goes on weekly in Forumbuildr, legally in a very “I’m only using the mechanics as designed” sort of way. The same mechanics that allowed today’s logo fest allow forum spamming every single week. It is not as noticeable since a wall of text just takes more to deal with than a picture. I don’t have a suggestion to help fix it, but I can’t help but feel that it is a damn shame since being able to get involved in creating part of the game is so unique and it would be really cool if it wasn’t so open to abuse.

Jalapeno Bootyhole Posted:

To tell you the truth, I’m still bewildered about the point of this exercise and what the outcome was supposed to be. At this point, I’m bumuming it’s some kind of vague frustration over…something. At the risk of sounding naive, would anyone on the inside care to explain it to me?

Boredom.

Your community is seeking some kind of entertainment. Since the game isn’t entertaining, bandwagons are the in thing.

I believe it was for this being the 7th week out of 8 we have a bashy forum and wanting buildr fixed or something, i don’t know exactly. But like hobo said, this wasn’t **** you trolling buildr, this was your bread and bumer, active players and active people in the community doing the trolling.

StrayNeko Posted:

I believe it was for this being the 7th week out of 8 we have a bashy forum and wanting buildr fixed or something, i don’t know exactly. But like hobo said, this wasn’t **** you trolling buildr, this was your bread and bumer, active players and active people in the community doing the trolling.

Well, Bashy didn’t win the previous week’s build. That’s “progress,” right? Was the protest meant to say, “Make Bashy stop submitting good ideas”?

Anyway, I kind of don’t mind the idea of limiting the amount of entries per category, in addition to limiting them overall, but we’re going to have to think about it.

Montressor Posted:

This ties in to some limited extent to dom too. Dom’s a solo game these days, nobody’s staying with klans, many of us are doing our best to provide a reason to stick around, but we’re failing. We’re having a hard time caring.

Yeah I miss old klan raiding Log in to see images!

At least it was a group activity Log in to see images!